Comments on: Octopus II: The Revenge.

Octopus II: The Revenge.

darth_tedious — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:23:37 -0800

Come for the Homicide, Stay for the Top Secret Beam-Weaponry Research: The daughter of a man killed along with two others in a slaying some link to the murder of Octopus researcher Danny Casolaro digs into the Web's conspiracy subculture; creates an elaborate online persona; succeeds, nearly thirty years after the murder, in tracking down a suspect via the Web; and then gets him arrested, put in orange jumpers, and hauled into court. Then, on the day of the hearing, Something Happens...

By: clavdivs

clavdivs — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:27:00 -0800

rattlesnakes...tistististis

By: hippybear

hippybear — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:40:04 -0800

Then Michael Murphy, a dapper prosecutor from the attorney general's office, rose and delivered a shocking blow. "We have lost confidence in our ability to proceed with the prosecution," he said. Begley closed her eyes tightly as the prosecutor gave a vague reason for his sudden about-face, something about "new information" and a reassessment of the evidence. Damn, this certainly reads like the third act plot twist of a thriller. Interesting that the conspiracy underground actually works with enough truth in some cases to yield an arrest. Even more interesting (and probably fuel for the conspiracy bonfire) that events took this turn. Is this a case of white noise overcoming the real signal, as the author of the piece seems to assert? Or is it just that all conspiracy theorizing is bullshit and the carefully constructed case fell apart once it got to trial because it was a house of cards? Why are there black helicopters circling my house?

By: mrbill

mrbill — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:44:15 -0800

Why are there black helicopters circling my house? I've always said that "they" don't use black helicopters. They use UPS trucks, because everybody just ignores the UPS truck.

By: chaff

chaff — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:46:29 -0800

The irritating thing about these tales is that they always start out so plausible. You have some crooked casino developers, OK, some government software shenanigans, fine, yes, some U.S. backed shady arms deals, mmmmaybe, I'll follow you that far, but then the next thing you know it's JFK and Area 51 and lizard people. My take is that various smart criminals of various allegiances have become very adept about blowing the kind of spooky smokescreens that cause legitimate investigations to sputter and die.

By: The World Famous

The World Famous — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:46:34 -0800

everybody just ignores the UPS truck. Everybody who doesn't order stuff online, that is.

By: hippybear

hippybear — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:46:54 -0800

They use UPS trucks, because everybody just ignores the UPS truck. Based on 5 years working as a delivery driver, I'll tell you... not everyone ignores them. (But yeah, nearly everyone, so I'll grant you that point.) Why is there a UPS truck outside my house? I didn't order anyth

By: hermitosis

hermitosis — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:47:35 -0800

Man this story has EVERYTHING.

By: doublehappy

doublehappy — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:48:38 -0800

I've always said that "they" are the people telling you that "they" use UPS trucks, because nobody suspects the suspicious. I always enjoy these stories far more than is reasonable.

By: klangklangston

klangklangston — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:52:55 -0800

"The irritating thing about these tales is that they always start out so plausible. You have some crooked casino developers, OK, some government software shenanigans, fine, yes, some U.S. backed shady arms deals, mmmmaybe, I'll follow you that far, but then the next thing you know it's JFK and Area 51 and lizard people. My take is that various smart criminals of various allegiances have become very adept about blowing the kind of spooky smokescreens that cause legitimate investigations to sputter and die." Yeah, I've talked to more than a few Former Secret Black Ops Wetwork Agents, and my instinct is that the plots are almost always part of defining their identity as far as justifying crazy actions. The criminals don't even need to be smart, they just need to project an image of being badass and be surrounded by credulous types (which, at least in the criminals that I've dealt with, there seem to be a lot of).

By: DU

DU — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:53:45 -0800

They used to used black helicopters because people used to ignore them. So if you've "always" said they don't use black helicopters you used to be lying and are therefore ONE OF THEM!!!!

By: brundlefly

brundlefly — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:58:25 -0800

Copying Seymour's files, which the author had gathered from archives, courts, and a confidential source's hidden trailer, Begley glimpsed the far reaches of the speculation: bioweapons, Lebanese heroin shipments, Howard Hughes, the yakuza. I would see this movie.

By: Lovecraft In Brooklyn

Lovecraft In Brooklyn — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 14:58:54 -0800

This sounds like the Micheal Bay remake of True Grit

By: doublehappy

doublehappy — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:00:39 -0800

They weren't actually helicopters, they were little cardboard cutouts of helicopters on really long transparent poles that secret agents were moving around from behind your neighbour's fence.

By: quin

quin — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:01:35 -0800

The problem with black helicopters is that when you view nearly any helicopter against a bright sky, it looks black in silhouette, and when you fly them at night you can't tell either. That's why we've stopped using them. Now we all travel around on hovercraft that read CONSPIRATORS across the front. It makes it much easier for people to see and write about us.

By: hermitosis

hermitosis — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:02:29 -0800

The fact that someone's trying to silence you does not necessarily mean you're actually right. It could be that you're just irritating.

By: The World Famous

The World Famous — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:03:38 -0800

bioweapons, Lebanese heroin shipments, Howard Hughes, the yakuza. Hangliding, pole vaulting, choppers . . .

By: mwhybark

mwhybark — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:04:12 -0800

Isn't Wired a company asset, anyway? Therefore, this piece would be expected to serve the purpose of reinforcing stereotypes about conspiracy theorists, right? "Begley lives and works in a rickety house at the end of a gravel road, next to a small pond and a rotting wood barn in a rural town outside Louisville, Kentucky, that she doesn't want named for security reasons. Out front, her "guard dog," an aging flat-coated retriever named Lucky, lazes beneath her porch. Begley is 43 and heavyset, with piercing blue eyes. On this day, her air conditioner is broken, and her round face glistens with sweat. She has four children, and for the moment she is collecting unemployment and selling a line of weight-loss shakes to make money on the side." I am joking here just as furiously as I need to be.

By: hermitosis

hermitosis — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:07:18 -0800

Hilarious. The instant I saw that the identity she created was named "Desertfae", I could tell exactly what kind of person I was dealing with here -- like, I could see and hear her in my mind! Then I got to watch her "introduction video," and started crying tears of merry laughter.

By: The World Famous

The World Famous — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:07:52 -0800

(and yes, I said "hangliding," as in gliding while dressed as Han Solo)

By: Pope Guilty

Pope Guilty — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:12:33 -0800

The fact that someone's trying to silence you does not necessarily mean you're actually right. It could be that you're just irritating. "They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown."

By: kmz

kmz — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:14:22 -0800

Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you. But they probably aren't.

By: Postroad

Postroad — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:16:21 -0800

There is a Fed X truck outside my house. Is that ok?

By: fairmettle

fairmettle — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:17:33 -0800

There is a Fed X truck outside my house. Is that ok? Does it have a secret arrow hidden in the logo?

By: kmz

kmz — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:18:05 -0800

Fed X is usually OK. If you see Fed Y or Fed Z though, run.

By: hermitosis

hermitosis — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:18:13 -0800

For all her elaborate video editing, there's this one, in which she sets out to make some probing calls live on camera. After a couple minutes of trying to reach people and getting only voicemail, she finally talks to someone who informs her it's Columbus Day. "Oh, THAT'S why I can't get anyone on the phone. That makes sense!" Really compelling stuff!

By: brundlefly

brundlefly — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:18:38 -0800

fairmettle: "Does it have a secret arrow hidden in the logo?" *brain breaks*

By: Artw

Artw — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:21:34 -0800

Wait... is this unrelated to this other crazy beam weapons thing?

By: boo_radley

boo_radley — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:22:22 -0800

Fed S is the one you gotta watch out for, they thought they were being clever! But no.

By: Cool Papa Bell

Cool Papa Bell — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:22:28 -0800

Man this story has EVERYTHING. Don't be thrown off when you're greeted at the door by a rabbi that looks Joaquin Phoenix. You're in the right place. Club owner Robert Blake has thought of everything. Goths, carnival barkers, groups of guys with Afros in graduation caps, human fire hydrants. You know, it's that thing when high-waisted midgets, with like, the red pants..."

By: grounded

grounded — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:35:26 -0800

Rachel Begley's father was murdered. I hope those responsible for his death are someday held accountable.

By: Sidhedevil

Sidhedevil — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:36:43 -0800

By: ChurchHatesTucker

ChurchHatesTucker — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:37:04 -0800

...everybody just ignores the UPS truck. Not my dog. You mean she's been trying to tell me something all this time? Maybe I should listen to the other things she tells me...

By: hincandenza

hincandenza — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:38:37 -0800

Jeez, way to ruin our fun oh your name is grounded oh well carry on then...

By: sbutler

sbutler — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:39:00 -0800

In my lifetime, I have known a few people who worked for very very secret government agencies (of various governments). Apparently, there are a lot more PowerPoint presentations than you might think. And a lot of shredding things. Very true. I have a buddy who works on projects he can't talk to me about. But what he did tell me was that once he spent several hours in a meeting where they discussed nothing but the color of his PowerPoint bar graphs.

By: kmz

kmz — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:40:17 -0800

he spent several hours in a meeting where they discussed nothing but the color of his PowerPoint bar graphs. Man, they really are evil.

By: KingEdRa

KingEdRa — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:41:39 -0800

My heart goes out to Begley; all she originally wanted was her father's murderer brought to justice. At the very least, she is owed an explantion by the prosecuter why he felt he couldn't prosecute the case. Strip away all the conspiracy theory stuff, and you still have the cold, hard reality of a murder to deal with here. No matter what the opinion of Begley is regarding her belief in The Octopus Conspiracy, she is very much a victim of a crime. I used to enjoy following stuff like this for the entertainment value, kind of a real life version of Umberto Eco's Foucault's Pendulum. As time has gone on and I learn about people like Begley, the more angry I become with the Conspiracy Theory community for exploiting people like her. There will never be an "end" to The Octopus Conspiracy, even if it's true. There are far too many people who need this (and other) conspiracies to provide meaning in their lives. It's not a conspiracy; it's a religion, and every religion needs martyrs. Ralph Boger is one of them for the Octopus Conspiracy Cult. I just wish that they would remember that martyrs have families, too.

By: paisley henosis

paisley henosis — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:44:53 -0800

Single page link. Interesting article, so far.

By: dougrayrankin

dougrayrankin — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 15:51:11 -0800

This never happened. You would do well not to mention it again.

By: Cool Papa Bell

Cool Papa Bell — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 16:11:43 -0800

Re: sharing secrets ... my uncle and aunt both work for a defense contractor in Dallas. Both have relatively high clearances for technical matters. However, they are not cleared for the other's project. That's right. They can't tell each other what they're working on. I mean, they both know they're engineers. But day to day conversation is verboten. Seriously, at the dinner table: "How was your day?" "Great. You?" "The same." I can't decide whether this is awesome or horrifying. They seem have a lot of sex. Not much small talk required there, I suppose.

By: ph00dz

ph00dz — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 16:31:29 -0800

Interesting read! ... you've gotta love stuff like this. 'Cuz... you know... what if they're right?

By: -harlequin-

-harlequin- — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 16:39:08 -0800

Very true. I have a buddy who works on projects he can't talk to me about. But what he did tell me was that once he spent several hours in a meeting where they discussed nothing but the color of his PowerPoint bar graphs. The awesome thing about top secret is you can spend all day doing this, or chatting at the water cooler, or otherwise producing next to nothing, and congress won't know and won't cut your budget. Ooh, that sounds pretty good actually. I think I need to get me a security clearance!

By: Hylas

Hylas — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 16:40:27 -0800

I'm not even remotely surprised that the prosecutor's response to Begley's internet pressure campaign was to drop the case. Her loony behavior is the "information" that tanked the case. dougrayranking: The fat man is drinking from the hose!

By: nevercalm

nevercalm — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 17:03:28 -0800

Ah, fuck this guy. How long do we have to go with the USian "intelligence" agencies making us look terrible?

By: TheWhiteSkull

TheWhiteSkull — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 17:11:31 -0800

Flowers By Irene? But I didn't order any flower arra

By: pla

pla — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 17:13:38 -0800

nevercalm : Ah, fuck this guy. How long do we have to go with the USian "intelligence" agencies making us look terrible? Well, y'know - Until they stop making us look terrible. As an aside... Did you all see a whole lot more to that story that I did? At the main link, I see only a single, fairly short, page (which looks like an intro but with no "next page" button), and nothing at all about beam weapons at any of the links.

By: scalefree

scalefree — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 17:16:28 -0800

As an aside... Did you all see a whole lot more to that story that I did? Yes. Follow this link to see it all.

By: pla

pla — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 17:20:29 -0800

scalefree : Yes. Follow this link to see it all. Ah! Thanks. Loves me a good conspiracy theory, I do! :D

By: Lovecraft In Brooklyn

Lovecraft In Brooklyn — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 17:35:43 -0800

The AV Club write-ups of the X-Files have been talking about the psychology of conspiracy theorists. It's oddly comforting to believe in a world where everything happens for a reason, even an obscure and sinister one.

By: KingEdRa

KingEdRa — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 17:50:30 -0800

I'm not even remotely surprised that the prosecutor's response to Begley's internet pressure campaign was to drop the case. Her loony behavior is the "information" that tanked the case. That, and as the article noted, all the pressure from the Conspiracy Theorists who had bothered DA's office. However, the police thought there was enough factual, provable evidence to reopen the case and arrest Hughes for the murder charge. As I noted above, the very least the Prosecutor could have done was explain to Begley why he felt that he couldn't win the case. Instead, there is no statement from the DA's office, which only further reinforces Begley and her fellow conspiracy dupes in their delusions. FWIW, I think that Begley is more to be pitied than mocked & scorned. Save your derision for the people who convinced her that there was this giant conspiracy behind her father's murder and that justice wouldn't prevail unless every single facet of it was exposed in a court of law.

By: Bathtub Bobsled

Bathtub Bobsled — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 18:35:27 -0800

Yes, I do believe there is SOME conspiracy out there, and that it goes waaaaaayy back and permeates a great deal of our daily lives. But I don't think that any outsider has an M&M's chance at fat camp of ever learning what it is. Here's why... Years ago, I had to set up a computer for a conference room. The first thing I noted is that they were very specific about me putting in a static IP address and ensuring that none of our company's monitoring software was running on the PC. They said it was simply so they could test a program out, but I saw who was attending and figured, yeah right lady. So I left my little USB camera that shoots pretty good SD video and records audio in the overhead projector and collected it after the meeting had been over. I played it and found out what the big secret was... They were planning an "conference" at one of our European locations. They were going to file all of the paperwork and ensure everyone had straightened out their stories, and they were even going to draw up documents and minutes for various meetings that were never going to occur. One of the managers at the European location were going to meet them at the airport, take their company ID cards, and laptops, then bid them adieu. For three days the 7 people chilled out in Italy while the proxy swiped their cards in, hooked their laptops to the network, they would remotely connect from various other devices, including additional laptops to check their mail periodically and have themselves logged into the network for anyone who did a check, even though someone noted "aside from [some guy who was out with back surgery] we would be the only ones requesting verification, but even then, security would request intent..." The manager, in exchange, was going to be have his presence requested at our California location for, most likely, the same treatment. All of this just so they could get an extra 3 days vacation with travel, room, and food, paid for by the company. That's it. They had a secret meeting and went through all the trouble just to get three days in Italy on the company's dollar. So, think about how much money and influence is at stake when you get into some of the arms deals, drug trafficking, intellectual property, and government. Tell me if you honestly believe there aren't at least a couple dozen people saying "Hey, if we keep it to just this group, we can really run the game, here."

By: kmz

kmz — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 19:01:34 -0800

Flowers By Irene? But I didn't order any flower arra There are three flowers in a vase. The third flower is green.

By: rmd1023

rmd1023 — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 19:02:13 -0800

Looking at the wired pic of Jimmy Hughes, all I can think of is the Horn Rimmed Glasses guy on "Heroes"

By: Kid Charlemagne

Kid Charlemagne — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 19:02:25 -0800

And their vast conspiracy was cut to the core by the computer guy and some geegaw he got at ThinkGeek or the like and the computer guy was so shocked he...rolled his eyes and...told the story...years later...on the internet!!! This is largely why I don't believe in conspiracy theories. I'd have to believe that a gang of conspirators had their shit together enough to pull off the amazingly convoluted plot and then keep it secret. Meanwhile the real life captains of industry can't even buy extra desert on the company credit card despite extensive planning without special agent Bathtub Bobsled recording the whole thing.

By: rmd1023

rmd1023 — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 19:10:06 -0800

As for conspiracies, I don't believe in your typical-in-entertainment-media omnipotent conspiracies. But there's certainly a whole lot of weird secret stuff going on out there in the world. It's a bit cognitively dissonant reading this just after reading the Atlantic article about Paul Haggis and Scientology. Reading about conspiracies I think are substantially true as described compared with reading about ones I think are substantially less intricately involved than some say they are.

By: XhaustedProphet

XhaustedProphet — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 21:11:59 -0800

bioweapons, Lebanese heroin shipments, Howard Hughes, the yakuza Needs more hookers and blow. And cowbell.

By: XhaustedProphet

XhaustedProphet — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 21:17:30 -0800

btw, if a pizza delivery driver comes up to you and says, "hey man, i have an extra pizza. do you want some?" Fucking run! Because seriously, pizza guys don't just carry around extra pizza, and if we do have extra pizza, we're taking it back to the shop so we can eat it. You have been warned.

By: scalefree

scalefree — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 21:59:41 -0800

I just wanted to stop in & remind people there were a couple of real conspiracies at the heart of this. First there was BCCI, a corrupt bank that laundered money for both the intelligence community & drug cartels. And then there was the PROMIS affair involving the theft, backdooring (by the same Michael Riconosciuto mentioned in the story) & sale of hundreds of copies of beyond-bleeding edge social network mapping software by the Mossad to other government & corporate intelligence agencies, that by all rights should be recognized as our real "electronic Pearl Harbor", a phrase that gets bandied about every time someone wants to impress the yokels he's "plugged in" to the threat of Information Warfare. And Danny Casolero's death had enough genuinely odd circumstances that it has to remain an open question as to whether it was suicide or assassination. Is it all connected? Good question.

By: PostIronyIsNotaMyth

PostIronyIsNotaMyth — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 23:29:14 -0800

I read the whole article... where was the beam research?

By: joshuahhh

joshuahhh — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 01:03:13 -0800

All this makes me wonder is, what the heck is in our water supply.

By: fullerine

fullerine — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 02:42:22 -0800

Echoing scalefree, the collapse of BCCI was like one of those delicious little films that get made in between takes of the main picture. The cast is the same, everyone's on the same side as usual, but the script is different. Also, if you are an evil, conspiring overlord how come you have such a small pool of staff to choose from? Seriously, when planning major international conspiracies you might want to choose someone other than the guys who fucked it up last time. "Liddy and Rumsfeld again?! Why not just haul up them front of the senate now to save some fucking time?" "Don't worry, we're going with Kerry for the investigation."

By: rough ashlar

rough ashlar — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 06:56:48 -0800

Interesting that the conspiracy underground actually works with enough truth in some cases to yield an arrest. Would that be like when a disabled mans home was taken and it took years for the conviction to get Supreme Court members jailed? Or how about this little snippet from events 15 years ago: (Alas - could not find a link to the actual released document - I'm rather sure one can get quite lost for days in the weeds of OKC Bombing truthers and I didn't need to spend time there) New documents released under the Freedom of Information Act confirm that the FBI received a phone call the day before the Oklahoma City bombing warning that the attack was imminent, and that the feds tried to reach a deal with bomber Terry Nichols to take the death penalty off the table if he admitted making the call. Now if the above is true the long tradition of the State being involved with domestic "events" continues...the British agents helping the IRA kill citizens, the Czar funding and helping Lenin and his merry band, the Lavon affair, the ...... well you get the idea. With documents like Northwoods and FBI COINTELPRO Black Panther coloring books as part of the public record - it is no wonder "theories" exist about what's going on. If you don't like conspiracy theories the best way is sunlight across the entire spectrum of power structures - so there is no way conspiracy theories can grow - and we the masses can get onto taming the nastier impulses of our fellow man - just like how a saner man said "NO" to faking a Cuban attack.

By: rough ashlar

rough ashlar — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 07:03:52 -0800

This is largely why I don't believe in conspiracy theories. I'd have to believe that a gang of conspirators had their shit together enough to pull off the amazingly convoluted plot and then keep it secret. Err, if the 'conspiracy theorists' have documents to support their POV for the actual event in question it isn't really all that secret. If the events or plans are published in the Congressional Record before the event - is that a conspiracy or even secret? How many of us read the Congressional Record - if "we" don't know of something is that a secret? And even if you have a court case with documents and witnesses you'll still have a group who will tack on a label of 'conspiracy theory'.....kinda like how you can find people at Free Republic saying Bush II - Iraqi Boogaloo was a great leader and how here on the Blue you'll find defenders of the Obama faith.

By: dances_with_sneetches

dances_with_sneetches — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 07:18:28 -0800

This is all ridiculous. The lizard people would never allow the Octopus to become so powerful.

By: steambadger

steambadger — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 07:34:14 -0800

My take is that various smart criminals of various allegiances have become very adept about blowing the kind of spooky smokescreens that cause legitimate investigations to sputter and die. Yes, this. If you're in charge of the Rosivarian Illumibergers, and you're depending on all your minions adhering to the code of omerta, then you're screwed. But if you hire Jim Marrs to write a book about the founding of your organization by three-headed lizards from Betelgeuse who ruled Atlantis in 10000 B.C., then you can just go ahead and discuss your mundane REAL conspiracy right out in the open, and nobody will believe you. You'll be ruling the world in no time!

By: chambers

chambers — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 08:04:21 -0800

I used to jokingly refer to unmarked white vans as the ones you should watch out for. One day at work, the subject of suspicious white vans came up, and a coworker told me of his recent road trip, where he became a little freaked out because about 5 times during his trip, on different highways, he was passed by several groups of three or four white vans, driving extremely fast and weaving in and out of traffic, and generally acting suspicous. They way this guy told it, ti did sound kinda creepy. Another of my coworkers was there and just laughed. He explained what was going on. He used to be a medic in the US Army, and the motor pools of the different Army bases had to organize and coordinate their stock of vans, so each base had enough to meet their needs. So, if one had a few to many, they would get a bunch of lower ranked guys, give them vans, and tell them which base to drop them off at. So give a bunch of young guys a car they can beat up as much as they want, can drive as fast as they want, because the police won't ticket them if they are stopped, and have them unsupervised and away from a very regimented life for a few hours, group idiocy will set in, and they will drive like maniacs to have a good time. And that explained the mystery of the vans.

By: longbaugh

longbaugh — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 09:50:12 -0800

That's what he told you. They actually had rendered civilians being transported between AFBs before being shipped overseas for torture. See how easy that is?

By: darth_tedious

darth_tedious — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 10:05:01 -0800

> where was the beam research? Some of the wilder legends (relatively speaking; there don't seem to be many tame ones) surrounding Michael Riconosciuto involve him performing particle beam work, as well as research into other forms of exotic weaponry, while working for Wackenhut on the sovereign Cabazon Reservation. Wilder legends yet deal with... well, here's a link to photocopies of the *apparently* certified letter he sent to his attorney in February of 2001, warning of an impending large scale hijacking attack by an Arabic group calling itself, "The Base"...

By: scalefree

scalefree — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 10:18:14 -0800

Wilder legends yet deal with... well, here's a link to photocopies of the *apparently* certified letter he sent to his attorney in February of 2001, warning of an impending large scale hijacking attack by an Arabic group calling itself, "The Base"... This would be a lot more believable if he now includes a forensic trail between himself & any of the known 9/11 players. That's a lot harder to forge than a single certified letter. Occam's Razor should never be discarded.

By: sonika

sonika — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 10:51:24 -0800

Ok, this was definitely interesting, but I'll admit - I started reading hoping that it was about an ACTUAL Octopus. Like marine biologists gone rogue or something. WHEN CEPHALOPODS KILL! That. That would be really awesome. And y'know, completely terrifying in every way.

By: ChurchHatesTucker

ChurchHatesTucker — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 10:55:41 -0800

WHEN CEPHALOPODS KILL! That. That would be really awesome. And y'know, completely terrifying in every way. I'm guessing you don't watch much Syfy.

By: nixt

nixt — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 13:06:36 -0800

Funny, the very first issue of Wired had an article on "The Octopus". It's less skeptical than the 2011 version.

By: threeturtles

threeturtles — Thu, 10 Feb 2011 23:11:29 -0800

The day I stopped believing in vast government conspiracies was the day an FBI profiler came to talk to one of my psychology classes. He specialized in serial killers and was really, really proud that they had just drawn up a nationwide database of serial killer profiles, victims, MOs, suspects, and felons. This was in 2001 and I figured that if the FBI was just getting around to putting serial killers into a searchable database, the average citizen didn't have much to worry about. I mean, the china shop I worked for over the summer had a database of their clients, but apparently the FBI did not have one for serial killers?