Comments on: Quitting Spotify in Hi-Res

Quitting Spotify in Hi-Res

deeker — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 06:26:25 -0800

As Spotify announce their long-trailed lossless audio streaming, it's worth looking at why many artists are quitting the platform altogether. (It's not just the royalties thing this time.)

Other artists - some as big as Taylor Swift and Neil Young - have previously taken their music off the music streaming behemoth, only to return to it later. Swift said, " I'm not willing to contribute my life's work to an experiment that I don't feel fairly compensates the writers, producers, artists, and creators of this music." Until she was. For money. Young quit the platform over their decision to host Joe Rogan, a known Covid-sceptic: "I realized I could not continue to support SPOTIFY's life threatening misinformation to the music loving public," he said in a statement. Just two years later, he too had returned, now saying that Apple and iTunes were no better, as they, too had begun hosting Logan's show: "Spotify, the #1 streaming of low res music in the world – Spotify where you get less quality than we made, will now be home of my music again." Also, money. Young will, presumably, be happier now that Spotify supports Hi-Res audio (even if naysayers will insist on pointing out that it's only just hi-res.) Nonetheless, artists have been quitting the platform left, right and centre. The complaints about streaming royalties haven't gone away and Rogan still earns crazy money for being long-form stupid and wilfully fascist-adjacent but this exodus stems from Spotify CEO Daniel Ek's recent investments into AI military defence company Helsing. Ek is now the Chairman of Helsing; Prima Materials has raised over $700 million for the company; and Helsing's focus on defense software had expanded to manufacturing drones, aircraft, and submarines. Ek is... unconcerned at the criticism: "I'm sure people will criticise it and that's OK. Personally, I'm not concerned about it. I focus more on doing what I think is right and I am 100 per cent convinced that this is the right thing for Europe." Others, however, noting that steaming (famously) doesn't actually earn them all that much anyway, finally cut the link: "Greg Saunier already had reasons to be wary of Spotify. The founder of the acclaimed Bay Area band Deerhoof was well acquainted with the service's meager payouts to artists and songwriters, often estimated around $3 per thousand streams. He was unnerved by the service's splashy pivots into AI and podcasting, where right-wing, conspiracy-peddling hosts like Joe Rogan got multimillion-dollar contracts while working musicians struggled. But Saunier hit his breaking point in June, when Spotify's Chief Executive Daniel Ek announced that he'd led a funding round of nearly $700 million (through his personal investment firm, Prima Materia) into the European defense firm Helsing. That company, which Ek now chairs, specializes in AI software integrated into fighter aircraft like its HX-2 AI Strike Drone. "Helsing is uniquely positioned with its AI leadership to deliver these critical capabilities in all-domain defence innovation," Ek said in a statement about the funding round. In response, Deerhoof pulled its catalog from Spotify. "Every time someone listens to our music on Spotify, does that mean another dollar siphoned off to make all that we've seen in Gaza more frequent and profitable?" Saunier said." At least one band, prolific genre-blending psych-rockers King Gizzard and the Lizard Wizard, has followed up by making their entire, and extensive, back catalogue at "name your price" on Bandcamp (a platform not entirely without issues but comparative saints). If you are still on Spotify and the atrocious royalties (including demonetising entirely the streams of music from artists with fewer than 1000 monthly listeners), the playlists filled with "fake" artists created by companies with contracts with Spotify and the platforming and promotion of AI-generated music havent convinced you to quit, perhaps King Gizzard's statement can convince you: "Hello friends... A PSA to those unaware: Spotify CEO Daniel Ek invests millions in AI military drone technology... We just removed our music from the platform... Can we put pressure on these Dr. Evil tech bros to do better?... Join us on another platform."

By: johngoren

johngoren — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 06:39:04 -0800

Haven't seen it covered much outside this Pitchfork piece but Spotify Hosts Trump Inauguration Brunch And Makes 150,000 Donation To Ceremony. This was enough to make me switch to CDs. Which has been so much fun. Besides the physical media pleasures, it's nice to know that if I buy a used Traveling Wilburys disk from a thrift shop it is benefitting some cat shelter and not neo-Nazis.

By: robot_jesus

robot_jesus — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 06:40:34 -0800

I am not a Spotify user but I'm hardly a saint as I get Apple Music bundled with the tier that includes all of the extra storage for my photos. So, you gotta serve somebody. But while Apple Music is not great, it's passable enough. The main feature I love is that I can easily upload all of my obscure MP3s to the library and they're immediately accessible from all my devices. But the annoyance I run into repeatedly is the network effect. Pretty much all of my friends and colleagues use Spotify. There are daily playlists and albums that people post in Slack. Sure, I can look up the same album or even potentially recreate a playlist in Music. But it's a lot of effort to listen to a playlist a coworker wants me to hear. I hate how large they've become.

By: robot_jesus

robot_jesus — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 06:46:22 -0800

Also, as an aside: I've been feeling that we're in for a grand reckoning for musicians and making a viable living. For decades, the industry has benefited greatly from format changes. When everyone's cars started having cassette decks, people bought Sgt. Peppers a second time even though they owned vinyl. And then bought it again for their discman. And then bought the MP3s for their iPod. I don't need to be told that vinyl sales are strong and that CDs can be ripped into MP3s. Or downloaded via Napster/Limewire. I'm well aware. But the reality is that while you could do that with physical media, a ton of people bought into each of these generational changes. My dad owned thousands of vinyl records, cassettes and CDs, and still went ahead bought MP3s for his iPods because it was easier. All the while this padded industry profits by getting us to re-buy the same music. Now with all-you-can-eat streaming, that's never happening again. Instead, the artists just get a drip of a few bucks per months for many of them.

By: deeker

deeker — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 06:53:30 -0800

robot_jesus: "the annoyance I run into repeatedly is the network effect" I feel you. I've never been a streaming subscriber, although I listen to a lot of music - but I know I've been missing out on playlists posted by outlets and record shops I really like that could switch me on to cool new stuff.

By: Spike Glee

Spike Glee — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:00:02 -0800

I also buy physical media. My streaming choice is Slackr (Live x Live) which is probably also problematic. The kid uses Spotify, and wants us to switch to it (partially so we can share playlists, and partially so she doesn't have to pay for it). She also buys physical media and goes to concerts (and buys merch there), so she's paying the artists more directly. (She also pays extra for the meet & have your pictures taken with the artist thing that a lot of KPop artists do.)

By: MisantropicPainforest

MisantropicPainforest — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:00:33 -0800

Anyone got recs to switch?

By: Melismata

Melismata — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:06:22 -0800

It's almost like having only one radio or TV station for the entire US is not a good business plan or something.

By: HearHere

HearHere — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:14:32 -0800

Anyone got recs to switch? bandcamp

By: phooky

phooky — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:16:18 -0800

Bandcamp. Broadcast radio. Indie internet radio stations. Physical media. MP3s on a quarter-century old Rio. There are so many options.

By: phooky

phooky — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:18:22 -0800

(I found an old transistor pocket radio a few weeks ago. Stuffed some batteries in it and took it with me to the beach. It was a whole vibe.) (if you're in/near NJ, my kids have been blasting 89.5 WSOU on the radio in their room as near to round the clock as I'll let them.)

By: deeker

deeker — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:23:02 -0800

MisantropicPainforest: "Anyone got recs to switch?" This FPP (by me, natch) has some suggestion in the comments.

By: Kitteh

Kitteh — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:38:44 -0800

I am lucky to be married to a tech savvy guy who has set up a music server for us on Plex. Shepherd spent a not insignificant amount of time uploading all our music--all the physical CDs I brought up from the US was part of it--and it is just the best fucking thing. Plex Music holds all our digital media, not just music. But the music part is incredible. Our current music database holds 1 year, 3 months, and 1 day of music if you were to play it straight through. We have made playlists for artists/bands, playlists for genres, personal playlists (f'rex, my beautiful serotonin playlist that I have titled All Clowners No Downers), and hitting shuffle on the entire catalog is an fantastic journey. So I can 100% recommend that but it's definitely for the nerdier more techy folks, or people who are married to those people.

By: 922257033c4a0f3cecdbd819a46d626999d1af4a

922257033c4a0f3cecdbd819a46d626999d1af4a — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:41:24 -0800

I use: Tidal Physical CDs WFMU KEXP SomaFM FM Radio

By: bwvol

bwvol — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:44:34 -0800

I really like SomaFM and especially recommend "Heavyweight Reggae." Lots of old school rocksteady, ska, and roots reggae.

By: butterstick

butterstick — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:53:26 -0800

Bandcamp pricing is pretty rad. $10 for an album in multiple formats. Feels like the 90s.

By: xedrik

xedrik — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:57:02 -0800

We watch enough content on YouTube that the subscription for YTPremium to remove the ads (and, hopefully, give some revenue to the creators) has been totally worth it. That subscription comes with YTMusic, which is "ehh... good enough" for us, as music streaming goes.

By: thecaddy

thecaddy — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:57:35 -0800

(New CDs in 1999 were regularly going for $15 or more at the time. That's at least $30 in 2025 dollars.) I really need to get on top of setting up a media server eventually. I keep blanching at how much a NUC costs.

By: rikschell

rikschell — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 07:59:18 -0800

I finally subscribed to YouTube Music, obviously not unproblematic itself. But I get a lot more joy out of life being able to discover new music, and when I find something I really like I will support the artist through buying a concert ticket or physical media (especially for smaller artists).

By: caution live frogs

caution live frogs — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 08:06:41 -0800

(Mods, can you swap out the link for "quitting the platform"? Article is from Rolling Stone, link is to a Yahoo news content farm - especially in a discussion about giving appropriate credit to the people generating media, we should be careful to do the same. Bonus, the Rolling Stone article doesn't offer to generate an AI summary.)

By: evilangela

evilangela — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 08:11:14 -0800

Yeah, I switched to Tidal after Spotify started giving Joe Rogan lots of money. I think it's like 4x more to the artist than Spotify - though that's also still not necessarily a lot. Streaming services have to be a boon to small artists, making it much easier for people to discover their music. I've found so many recently that I can't imagine having gotten into without the option, and am going out of my way to actually purchase their music on CD - though there are some without physical purchase options yet, so I wait patiently for that day. (c'mon King Mala, give us a physical of your new album!)

By: q*ben

q*ben — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 08:36:12 -0800

I was talking to my kid about their friends in bands trying to MAKE IT and they told me something I hadn't heard before- lots of newish local bands are delaying dropping songs to streaming, in favor of a combination of physical media sales and social media shorts / animatics. The conventional wisdom apparently being that Spotify is crap for new music discovery and essentially exists as a convenience for established fans.

By: pinothefrog

pinothefrog — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 08:49:28 -0800

The thing that finally got me to switch my personal listening* away from streaming to a mix of MP3's (that I buy nowadays) and physical media was when Google Play Music became YouTube music and the software was terrible. So I spent a bunch of money buying new stuff on Bandcamp that I'd been listening to on streaming. Then I found Musicolet for Android and the open source software Strawberry for desktop, and the control over how I listen to music is amazing. I love being able to have up to 30-something queues going at once. Why would I want that? Well, say you start listening to an album or a playlist in one context, but then you switch to another context (like going to bed or you've got your kid in the car so you're playing other music). You can then go back to that album or playlist later and continue where you left off. YouTube Music often couldn't remember what album I was in the middle of playing when I simply put it in the background. If I buy a new album and don't have time to listen to it right away, I can start a queue and pause it. This acts like a bookmark. I have in the past forgotten about albums I've bought. I don't think there's anything like this in streaming services. I used to add new music to playlists but that got way more cumbersome, because playlists are supposed to stick around and queues more or less go away when you're finished. Strawberry also has a lot of nice options for smart playlists, where you can tell it to play things you haven't played in a while, or play only things you recently acquired. And none of them are under the influence of AI or algorithms created with an agenda. I like buying things and knowing most of the money goes to the artist. But also the experience of listening to digital music I own and physical media is so much better. (*unfortunately, we still subscribe as a family because my partner uses YouTube for work-related reasons and it's where we play our kids' music)

By: rebent

rebent — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 08:50:23 -0800

Since leaving band camp and subscribing to Spotify about 5 years ago, I've been able to listen to thousands of hours of fantastic, mind-blowing music from classic jazz to classic prog rock to classic early techno to classic triphop... But I have no idea who is making music I'd like now. Really hoping that https://subvert.fm/ launches well!

By: JHarris

JHarris — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 08:51:04 -0800

But the annoyance I run into repeatedly is the network effect. Pretty much all of my friends and colleagues use Spotify This is the challenge of the moment. When it seems like everyone else is using EvilCo, should you use them too? Everyone draws that line in a different place. But I've gotten a great account of satisfaction from avoiding, whenever I can, the likes of Twitter, Reddit and Spotify. Sometimes it's not possible, but I can make a positive choice to not browse there or use them personally. The Internet is full of wonders, enough so that you don't actually have to partake of all of them. It's fine not to use the big sites. You can usually find a decent alternative. The knowledge that Reddit crushed their volunteer staff, charge big money to use their API and sold their users out to AI companies obliterated any joy I get from going there, and I won't make posts, here or elsewhere, that link to them. Whether other people to do or not matters much less than whether I do, to me. I'm through with making Faustian bargains, none of them have been worth it.

By: criticalyeast

criticalyeast — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 09:03:03 -0800

A year ago, I decided to host my own streaming service on a FreedomBox running Navidrome. I'm reasonably conversant in this stuff, but a total noob at running a server. This setup is about as plug-and-play as you get with self-hosting. My entire MP3 library came back to life overnight! Now I use Deezer to stream new music (and I do, heavily) and can listen to the stuff I own anywhere in the world. I can also grant access to my library when friends want it, and the fash never enter the chat.

By: MrGuilt

MrGuilt — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 09:04:10 -0800

robot_jesus: Pretty much all of my friends and colleagues use Spotify. There are daily playlists and albums that people post in Slack. Sure, I can look up the same album or even potentially recreate a playlist in Music. But it's a lot of effort to listen to a playlist a coworker wants me to hear. I hate how large they've become. I've used TuneMyMusic for this. The free tier ("up to 500 tracks") generally meets my needs. It takes a few minutes, and the track match is not perfectly 1:1. But I suspect it will get you definitely in the ballpark, and probably to the infield. Like you, I use Apple Music. It's a combination of having a backlog from pre-streaming days, the ability to incorporate random tracks across devices, and it being bundled with other services I use. As you say, you got to serve someone.

By: thebots

thebots — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 09:17:44 -0800

I spend most of my time on NTS Radio these days, and then buy either physical media or albums from Bandcamp. This system suits me a lot better than Spotify ever did, which I felt tended to silo me into certain sounds over time.

By: the sobsister

the sobsister — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 09:25:00 -0800

Could someone point me in the direction of a for-dummies-level explainer on setting up a (Mac-based) server to stream one's own music ? Is this better positioned as an AskMe? Happy to do that too. Thanks.

By: aldus_manutius

aldus_manutius — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 09:38:26 -0800

As a recording/performing musician, the struggle is real and I'm using every practical means to avoid having to use any of the streaming services... PLEASE for the sake of musicians, try some of the alternatives listed here. Thanks for posting this.

By: ArmandoAkimbo

ArmandoAkimbo — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 10:12:32 -0800

Could someone point me in the direction of a for-dummies-level explainer on setting up a (Mac-based) server to stream one's own music ?

If streaming is a requirement (vs. just syncing your library to your iPhone), it's easy to get started with Plex Media Server for macOS and use PlexAmp as your player. If you're not too intimidated by light terminal/command line use, Navidrome is a popular choice music server supported by several apps. Dopper (with Dopper Transfer) is another option that I haven't personally used, but that I've seen recommended.

By: Smedly, Butlerian jihadi

Smedly, Butlerian jihadi — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 11:09:50 -0800

Another vote for Tidal. I have been really, really happy with the service they offer. I frequently discover artists I haven't heard otherwise (for example, I was onto Ela Minus months before I ever heard her on KEXP. I'm sure whatever richy-rich types are at the top aren't great either, but as a company, they're hella better than Spotify for all the reasons listed, and offer the same convenience with better sound quality* and slightly more money to the artists. But yeah, the real joy is knowing I'm not funding Rogan and (apparently) a budding military industrial complex ghoul. When I find artists I like, I try to buy a record or see them live and buy a T-shirt, or all of the above. *This was a big selling point when we switched, not sure how true it is anymore.

By: SaltySalticid

SaltySalticid — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 12:02:02 -0800

College radio is still pretty cool, and almost all of them stream. Many even don't have ads! You can get the live stream but also usually stream specific shows, like on jazz or punk etc. Check out your locals, the next state over, the big name schools, you will likely find some good stuff.

By: midmarch snowman

midmarch snowman — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 12:29:05 -0800

I've started a shift to a personal media server on Plex for movies. But my music consumption has always been heavily skewed toward a usage pattern that makes commercial streaming an unassailably good option. I tried Apple / Tidal / and Pandora back during Covid / Neil Young bit and sadly Spotify worked better at the time. Like much better. Like especially with Apple Watch usage which is nuts that they worked better for me than Apple Music. I will likely try again in the future, but network effect has me locked in currently, as I derive way too much personal enjoyment engaging with my community of theater dorks with Music League, which is currently best integrated with Spotify. Appreciate the post. It moves the needle, I'll probably get there eventually.

By: Artifice_Eternity

Artifice_Eternity — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 12:33:13 -0800

As a musician, I would prefer folks to use just about any streaming service that isn't Spotify. They all pay musicians peanuts, but Spotify pays less than almost anyone, and takes advantage of artists -- and listeners -- in numerous other sleazy ways. I usually suggest Apple Music or Tidal as top alternatives. They have much better compensation rates for musicians. Bandcamp is great -- please visit artists' Bandcamp pages! -- but it's not a 1:1 substitute for a streaming service.

By: It is regrettable that

It is regrettable that — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 13:31:34 -0800

For those who want to enjoy Spotify playlists but don't have Spotify, there is the aptly named I don't have Spotify. I haven't tried it, but it seems to be designed to be a relatively straightforward way not to have to be left out of sharing entirely. I see some recommendations for Bandcamp up above, including its mention in the initial post as "a platform not entirely without issues but comparative saints." I thought that they, too, were fairly suspect since their purchase by Epic Games and Songtradr. Are they still an ethical choice, or only the least non-ethical choice? Finally, I'm a cheapskate. I listen to Spotify because they've got a free tier. Nobody seems to mention good ol' Pandora, but I also use them, because free. Is Pandora my best choice if I'm willing to suffer through ads for free music, or is there a more ethical streaming provider?

By: Artifice_Eternity

Artifice_Eternity — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 14:12:35 -0800

I thought that they, too, were fairly suspect since their purchase by Epic Games and Songtradr. Are they still an ethical choice, or only the least non-ethical choice? People were worried about this, but honestly, they haven't really done anything particularly shady under the new owners. I think they laid off a few people whose job was to write articles about music on the platform, but that was it. The basic terms for musicians and fans haven't changed in any notable way.

By: tavella

tavella — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 14:15:42 -0800

When I don't want to mp3s I own, I use Pandora. No idea how much it pays artists, but I've definitely discovered new ones there.

By: LizBoBiz

LizBoBiz — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 14:24:31 -0800

The conventional wisdom apparently being that Spotify is crap for new music discovery and essentially exists as a convenience for established fans. I'd agree. I used Spotify a lot when I was studying for exams and I found that it was really great at finding me songs I like, but really really bad a finding bands that I like. As someone who really enjoys going to shows, I need bands, not songs. (I'm a physical CD person. I have ripped all my cds and put them on my iPhone. I don't want to need to internet to listen to my music. Some of my friends thought that was weird until we were at a place with no signal, which meant I was the only one with music available. )

By: LizBoBiz

LizBoBiz — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 14:28:08 -0800

Also +1 for Pandora. They really got me back in the day with the Music Genome Project

By: srboisvert

srboisvert — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 14:39:12 -0800

I ditched spotify during the start of the pandemic when every second ad they played at me was for dog dewormer (no doubt an Ivermectin sneak around).

By: kickingtheground

kickingtheground — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 14:47:24 -0800

The conventional wisdom apparently being that Spotify is crap for new music discovery[...]

Gotta say - my experience is very much the exact opposite of this.

By: brachiopod

brachiopod — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 16:01:17 -0800

I went to Tidal after Rogan came on. The only real noticeable difference is on Apple Car Play, where I have to conclude voice commands with "...on Tidal".

By: Thorzdad

Thorzdad — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 16:41:27 -0800

When I don't want to mp3s I own, I use Pandora. No idea how much it pays artists, but I've definitely discovered new ones there. I've always found Pandora to be far better than Spotify. It's pretty simple to use and seems to have a better algo for discovering new artists. They really, really want me to subscribe, though.

By: drowsy

drowsy — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 19:52:04 -0800

Deerhoof pulled their music like the day after I saw them live, and I thought maybe I played Dept of Corrections too many times and got banned personally from doing it again... Seriously hundreds of times.

By: drowsy

drowsy — Fri, 12 Sep 2025 19:56:18 -0800

Oh yeah I pay for my Deerhooves via bandcamp but its an archive I hate using it to listen. Maybe its pandora time. Apple dissappeared all my music once, never again. I only use itunes to stream WFMU.

By: tommasz

tommasz — Sat, 13 Sep 2025 04:17:37 -0800

Heh, Neil Young and I quit Spotify for the same reason (I was first). I mostly listen to music I own, including in the car via an iPod Touch. When I'm away from my house or car, it's Pandora. If you do use Spotify, you should be aware of this.

By: mathjus

mathjus — Sun, 14 Sep 2025 02:37:06 -0800

The recording industry was an aberration. Some lucky people cashed in. There's a gasping gift economy that some even luckier people now can extract a living from. But the thing they sell isn't worth anything in the marketplace. Music will be fine. Recordings are done. There's no meaningful stance to be had on Spotify. Toothpaste is out of the tube.

By: Didymus

Didymus — Sun, 14 Sep 2025 07:37:09 -0800

There's no meaningful stance to be had on Spotify. This is meaningful for me tho: I don't use Joe Rogan-platforming Spotify

By: emptythought

emptythought — Sun, 14 Sep 2025 22:59:14 -0800

Probably the longest time "digital music library" person i know irl, i have a library with files dated 1997 and 98. Retired last.fm snob, veteran of every great music tracker. Anyone got recs to switch? Youtube music. It wins for me by far just because it has everything. If it can't find it in its own database, it'll find some upload of it from 2009 and let you slot it right into the main interface, your playlists, etc. It wins for me by such a huge margin just because it has a ton of vinyl rips, obscure underground music, everything. There's surprisingly popular 90s grunge bands or dance music producers where this is the only way to coherently stream their music. Don't get me wrong, bandcamp is cute too. But it doesn't have like, some obscure old UK garage or 2005 dubstep record i really wanna throw on for a long drive. The hole it filled for me was one formerly filled by Grooveshark(RIP, godd). Outside of my local library, sometimes i just want to be able to sign in or look up a playlist on someones phone/tablet/pc and throw a specific playlist on at a kickback or afters. And there's nowhere to plug in a damn ipod anymore...

By: area.man

area.man — Mon, 15 Sep 2025 08:52:29 -0800

Nuked Spotify recently and were not sparing with words in the "tell us why you're cancelling" box, not that I expect anyone reads it/that it matters. Have YT music by default with YT premium and, as others have said, it's... fine. (Google is obviously not without their issues.) More than anything, I have really been enjoying getting back into physical CD's recently. Thus far we have built a lovely little collection from a mix of new/used/thrift stores/ebay/bandcamp/discogs, and even just grabbing interesting things from the public library. It's nice to *own* things.