Comments on: Starships, sofas, Hugo awards, podcasts, gambles and wind-ups

Starships, sofas, Hugo awards, podcasts, gambles and wind-ups

Artw — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 15:49:27 -0800

Due to a rewording of the rules Science Fiction podcast StarShipSofa (previously, previously, previously) could be eligible for a Hugo award. Meanwhile the current episode features The Gambler (text version here), a story by Paolo Bacigalupi - best known as the author of The Windup Girl, one of TIME Magazine's ten books of the year ("Not just science fiction, mind, but fiction, generally") and almost certainly a favorite for the Hugo's best novel category.

By: Artw

Artw — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 15:52:01 -0800

Rather fittingly The Gambler is in part about clicks and social media. It's pretty cutting edge as SF goes, which is pretty risky - it was first published in 2008 and still feels pretty fresh and relevant to me, but as things change in the next few years I could see it starting to seem old hat pretty quickly. Still, great story.

By: brundlefly

brundlefly — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 16:36:56 -0800

I just read about The Windup Girl and it sounds fascinating. Have you read it, Artw?

By: Artw

Artw — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 16:39:08 -0800

Bacigalupi Gets Two Nebula Nominations There's a lot of names there familiar to me through StarShipSofa actually (Jason Sanford, Ted Kosmatka). They podcast Vinegar Peace, or the Wrong-Way Used-Adult Orphanage a while back as well.

By: Artw

Artw — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 16:48:26 -0800

Have you read it, Artw I have to admit that it's in a stack on the bedside table. The Gambler means it gets a promotion to top of the pile though. Pump Six and Other Stories has some awesome stories in it, inclusing The Calorie Man, which sounds like it's the basis for Windup. I almost regret that he's moving on to writing novels and not staying a short story who turns out perfect stories every so often, like Ted Chiang, though you pretty much have to take a vow of poverty to do that.

By: amuseDetachment

amuseDetachment — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 16:48:59 -0800

I just finished reading The Windup Girl last night and would definitely recommend it. I would describe it as a biotech The Diamond Age (instead of nanotechology, but without Stephenson's tendency for crap endings and BS namedroppy-posturing). It feels as though The Windup Girl may become a canonical Science Fiction book.

By: penguinliz

penguinliz — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 17:16:52 -0800

Am I the only person who doesn't like listening to fiction? I just get frustrated with how slowly it goes compared to how fast I could be reading it. I get bored with most podcasts for the same reason, but I'll give SSS a go since everyone seems to like it. Unfortunately I am a grumpy old fart who likes paper fanzines and plans to nominate as many as possible since I think the category has a couple of years before it's filled with blogs and podcasts and the paper zines are squeezed out, plus I have an aversion to all Hugo self-promotion, so SSS won't be getting my nomination thi year. Haven't read The Windup Girl, but I've heard good things about it (and a few not so good things) and I do like Bacigalupi's short fiction. It's the io9 book club pick and they may still be offering a free epub from that link. The Calorie Man is in the same setting, and you can read it for free.

By: Justinian

Justinian — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 17:25:35 -0800

James, whom penguinliz links to above, knows his SF like nobody's business. But I think he (like me, actually) may be a little jaded from reading so much of it and demands a level of believable worldbuilding which excludes a lot of fine books. To be fair, the level of worldbuilding he looks for is "not completely unbelievable and ridiculous". Which is easily a defensible viewpoint. But I still think it excludes some fine novels. Of course it excludes far more extremely terrible ones too. So I do find it hard to be too critical of that particular filter.

By: amuseDetachment

amuseDetachment — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 17:40:10 -0800

Having read the book as well, I'm not sure the criticism that James Nicoll makes is quite justified. I wouldn't describe this book as "hard sci-fi". The author doesn't spend much time explaining how the world became the way it is, it doesn't establish specific causes for the current environment, nor does it go into detail as to how the technology works — it just dumps you into the world. Functionally, it's much more a piece to describe how people live in a world with climate change and resource shortages. It's very much centralized around an ensemble of individuals, this is not one of those books that has The Special Scientist That Solves Everyone's Problems By Explaining/Narrating A Technical Solution In Detail. I'm fairly sick of neckbeardy sci-fi, though (and may have an axe to grind with that kind of fiction now), so take form that what you will.

By: Justinian

Justinian — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 18:03:25 -0800

James never says the novel is hard SF. Other types of SF (which constitute the vast majority) still have to make sense. James summarizes Bacigalupi's approach to worldbuilding as:

as long as the setting feels right to him, he's not going to double-check to see if it makes sense.

Which I think is fair. And is basically designed to annoy the hell out of James Nicoll. He's not asking for hard SF, he's asking for something that at least passes the laugh test. I agree with him. It's just that our laugh tests vary considerably.

By: mrbill

mrbill — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 20:59:48 -0800

DRM-free Ebook versions of Pump Six and Windup Girl are available from Baen's WebScriptions for a measly six bucks each. I just picked up both of them for my Kindle.

By: ChurchHatesTucker

ChurchHatesTucker — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 23:17:14 -0800

Yeah, podcasts need more love. SSS in particular is a new iteration of he old skool trade mags.

By: Justinian

Justinian — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 23:23:38 -0800

Uh. In a novel twist, Paolo Bacigalupi replies to James and admits that he, too, hates his own book. Or something.

To be honest, I have almost the same problems with the book that you do, so please don't think you're alone in hating it. I think you've nailed the key problems with the story and its world quite nicely.

I'm not sure I've ever actually seen an author go "yeah, that part was shit" about his own work before. Weird.

By: Artw

Artw — Fri, 19 Feb 2010 23:53:34 -0800

His response to "Then why the hell did you write it?" is pretty good: Because that was where the story led. Also because I'm compulsive about trying to finish stories, even when I'm in doubt about them. To some extent, I have a lot of control over what I'm doing as a writer, and to some extent the story takes over and goes where it goes, and then I spend a bunch of time trying to smooth over the stupid parts, trying to balance between what seems most interesting in the story and what is most realistic, but obviously people's mileage will vary. And on any given day, my own mileage varies as well. I fix it as best I can, and then let it go. For some people the attempt works, for some it's tripe. I go back and forth. In any case, I think James' critique is as relevant as any of the positive reviews the story has gotten. He's read it, focused on it, and nailed some key issues. What more can a writer really ask of a reader? -Paolo

By: ennui.bz

ennui.bz — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 04:48:36 -0800

Having read the book as well, I'm not sure the criticism that James Nicoll makes is quite justified. Having just read the book (6 bucks I think is a nice price from drm-free text by the way), I wouldn't have bothered responded to criticism from james Nicoll who seems mostly annoyed that Paolo isn't as sceptical about global warming as he is... the problem with hard sci-fi is that if it were really 'hard' it wouldn't be fiction. in this day and age, on most topics, advancing actual knowledge is a pretty hard bar to reach, aside from trying to tell a diverting story. i couldn't care less whether a giga-joule is a plausible amount of stored energy for a coiled metal spring. my problem with "the windup girl" is that it is a novel about environmental and social/political catastrophe created by science and technology, but it really has very little to say other than catastrophe sucks. it doesn't seem to develop any strong opinion on the relationship between genetic engineering and global commerce and the politics thereof other than 'bad things could happen.' i think there is a lot one could say on these topics and i'm sure the author has opinions... but they don't seem to come out in the novel. also, the rape girl thing was a bad cliche and constructed in such a way so that the impact was muted. but otherwise a good read.

By: ennui.bz

ennui.bz — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 05:00:06 -0800

also, the Gambler reads as a nice retelling of the classic story by Melville of Bartleby, the Scrivener

Now and then, in the haste of business, it had been my habit to assist in comparing some brief document myself, calling Turkey or Nippers for this purpose. One object I had in placing Bartleby so handy to me behind the screen, was to avail myself of his services on such trivial occasions. It was on the third day, I think, of his being with me, and before any necessity had arisen for having his own writing examined, that, being much hurried to complete a small affair I had in hand, I abruptly called to Bartleby. In my haste and natural expectancy of instant compliance, I sat with my head bent over the original on my desk, and my right hand sideways, and somewhat nervously extended with the copy, so that immediately upon emerging from his retreat, Bartleby might snatch it and proceed to business without the least delay. In this very attitude did I sit when I called to him, rapidly stating what it was I wanted him to do—namely, to examine a small paper with me. Imagine my surprise, nay, my consternation, when without moving from his privacy, Bartleby in a singularly mild, firm voice, replied, "I would prefer not to."

By: i_am_a_Jedi

i_am_a_Jedi — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 05:23:12 -0800

The Windup Girl is a great book. Glad to see it on the blue. It's very nice to see a book from probably my favorite small press get this much recognition. I like his short stories very much and it seems like Paolo is not a big asshole like Chiang is reported to be. Hopefully it all translates into more for me to read of his in the future.

By: Artw

Artw — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 07:09:38 -0800

Ooooh? What's this about Chiang? TBH given how much I like his stuff it's remarkable how little I know about him. He could be this vending machine in Redmond that spits out a perfectly formed story every six months for all I know.

By: jscalzi

jscalzi — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 07:41:45 -0800

i_am_a_Jedi: "I like his short stories very much and it seems like Paolo is not a big asshole like Chiang is reported to be." [ Puts on his "I Actually Know These People" hat ] Paolo is a sweetheart and a very nice human being and (as this year's Nebula nods strongly imply) a hell of a writer. Ted Chiang is also hell of a writer and very much not an asshole, and I'm not really at all sure how such a "report" has come to be, unless someone has confused his exacting nature with being a jerk. [ Takes off Hat ]

By: Artw

Artw — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 07:45:24 -0800

Aha! So he has an actual physical presence?

By: fearfulsymmetry

fearfulsymmetry — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 08:31:28 -0800

One of the early episodes of the Tor podcast features an interview with Paolo Bacigalupi which I seem to remember was quite interesting, despite the rest of the podcast being a bit of a let down.

By: fearfulsymmetry

fearfulsymmetry — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 08:41:06 -0800

He could be this vending machine in Redmond that spits out a perfectly formed story every six months for all I know. No that's Greg Egan, who is actually an AI running on a super computer humming away in a secret bunker beneath the University of Western Australia.

By: Justinian

Justinian — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 10:44:12 -0800

Ted Chiang is also hell of a writer and very much not an asshole, and I'm not really at all sure how such a "report" has come to be, unless someone has confused his exacting nature with being a jerk. Well, one person's perfectionism is another person's "being a jerk". My guess is that the reports of him being a jerk came about with regard to what happened with the various editions of Stories of Your Life and Others, in which Chiang was reportedly so, um, "exacting" as you put it with regard to the cover art that when it came to putting out the trade paperback those involved simply said to hell with it and didn't put any cover art on it at all, which as you know is a kiss of death in terms of sales. I'm sure he's a great person. But it sure doesn't sound like you'd want to work with him as a cover artist or whatever!

By: jscalzi

jscalzi — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 11:41:03 -0800

Justinian: "But it sure doesn't sound like you'd want to work with him as a cover artist or whatever!" As it happens, I know others who have worked with him regarding cover art and had no problem with him whatsoever. Moreover, in that particular instance there's no indication that he acted like a jerk to anyone; it's possible to have strong creative differences with others and still conduct one's self politely, if forcefully. It's not necessarily useful to conflate a person's personality from a single instance of disagreement, particularly when that instance is regarding business, not his personal interactions with others.

By: Justinian

Justinian — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 12:22:05 -0800

What we would use the internet for if not to make wild generalizations or inferences from too little data? Well, that and porn.

By: ShawnStruck

ShawnStruck — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 14:18:01 -0800

Aha! So he has an actual physical presence? Of course! The last time there was a Chiang visitation there were 3 miracle cures, two sudden instances of cancers, and 8.5 million in property damage.

By: cerulgalactus

cerulgalactus — Sat, 20 Feb 2010 16:02:39 -0800

penguinliz - am I the only one who had trouble with the free epub file of Windup Girl (I transferred it to Stanza on my iPhone and it would only show the first page of every chapter, which amounted to less than 100 words each time).

By: Artw

Artw — Sun, 21 Feb 2010 08:39:55 -0800

The Tor.com podcats is well worth a listen for Paolo's bit. However I do find his views on what might help SF magazines a bit bizarre. Still, if someone asked me what would help them I'd probably say that nothing would and that sliding off into oblivion is inevitable for them...

By: filthy light thief

filthy light thief — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 15:35:37 -0800

I read The Gambler on my way home, finished most of it while bouncing along on a bus, and had to finish it before I did anything else. Thanks for the links to his other material, penguinliz. Little update on Windup Girl on io9 - you can ask him questions, and he'll join in tomorrow (Feb. 26) at 12 PST.

By: Artw

Artw — Mon, 01 Mar 2010 21:07:04 -0800

Starship sofa interview with Ted Chiang

By: Artw

Artw — Mon, 01 Mar 2010 21:10:17 -0800

Oh, and I;m partway through Windup Girl now. It really is quite excellent. James Nicoll was being a bit of a tool, I'm afraid.

By: Artw

Artw — Fri, 05 Mar 2010 10:30:50 -0800

Jason Sanford on the Nebulas

By: Artw

Artw — Sun, 07 Mar 2010 08:16:27 -0800

Keep Me Out Of The Great Podcast Fiction Kerfuffle of Early 2010