Playwright/performing artist Danny Hoch was originally cast as the Pool Guy in this episode. According to Hoch he objected to what he felt was ethnic stereotyping in the way his character was written: a stereotype of a "crazy Hispanic named Ramon." After Hoch unsuccessfully tried to have the character changed, he said that Jason Alexander and Julia Louis-Dreyfus were supportive of him, while Michael Richards told him he would be fired if he didn't play the role as written. Hoch then returned to his hotel room, and shortly afterwards received a phone call telling him he was being replaced and he should fly home as soon as possible. He told this story on a 2005 television documentary Race Is the Place and in his one-man show Jails, Hospitals & Hip Hop.posted by kmz at 10:59 AM on June 9, 2015 [61 favorites]
My daughter's 14. My wife says to her, 'Well, you know, in the next couple years, I think maybe you¡¯re going to want to be hanging around the city more on the weekends, so you can see boys.' You know what my daughter says? She says, ¡®That¡¯s sexist.¡¯So, it's not between Seinfeld and his daughter. And the point is that she will be more interested in boys as she ages, not that she can't think about anything else. It looked to me like the mother was expecting a certain set of changes in her daughter that track with how many people change over time. I fail to see the sexism in that. I wish *my* mom had made it easier to pursue boys. But hell, I was scared enough as a teen that I barely could chase my own shadow.
¡°There¡¯s nothing like going and seeing nothing but black. Black people. I mean from the wino to the president, it¡¯s black people¡I guess, for some, this is proof that he submitted to the PC police.
One thing I got out of it was magic. I¡¯d like to share it with you. I was leaving, and I was sitting in the hotel and a voice said to me, it said, ¡®Look around, what do you see?¡¯ And I said, ¡®I see all colors of people doing everything, you know.¡¯ And the voice said, ¡®Do you see any niggers?¡¯ And I said, ¡®No.¡¯ And it said, ¡®You know why? Because there aren¡¯t any.¡¯ And it hit me like a shot...
I was sitting there, I said, ¡®Yeah, I been here three weeks and I haven¡¯t even said it. I haven¡¯t even thought it.¡¯ And it made me think, Oh my God, I¡¯ve been wrong. I¡¯ve been wrong...
I ain¡¯t never going to call another black man a nigger. You know, because we never was no niggers. That¡¯s a word that¡¯s used to describe our own wretchedness. And we perpetuate it now. Because it¡¯s dead. That word is dead. [We¡¯re] men and women...
And I don¡¯t want them hip white people coming up to me, calling me no nigger or telling me nigger jokes. I don¡¯t like it. I¡¯m just telling you, it¡¯s uncomfortable to me. I don¡¯t like it when black people say it to me. So I love you all, and you can take that with you."
Is that the kind of maturity you mean?That question was directly posted to me. I'm uncertain in what way I'm permitted to answer it. I believe you know it wasn't what I meant.
Love alone can unite living beings so as to complete and fulfill them... for it alone joins them by what is deepest in themselves. All we need is to imagine our ability to love developing until it embraces the totality of men and the earth.posted by wemayfreeze at 1:31 PM on June 9, 2015 [10 favorites]
¡ª Teilhard de Chardin
It¡¯s absolutely true that some individuals use political correctness to disguise what is, in reality, a regressive devotion to propriety. There are people who simply have no sense of humour. It¡¯s possible that a small few just relish the takedown but don¡¯t care about the politics. But none of that has anything to do with whether or not it is correct to treat people with dignity and care; to call them by the names they¡¯ve taught you; and to remain open, elastic and humble enough to catch up when you¡¯re behind and apologise when you¡¯re in error. No one is required to do any of these things, but that doesn¡¯t mean they¡¯re not good things to do.posted by edbles at 2:40 PM on June 9, 2015 [26 favorites]
What do you make of the attempt to bar Bill Maher from speaking at Berkeley for his riff on Muslims?posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 7:03 PM on June 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
Well, I love Bill, but I stopped playing colleges, and the reason is because they¡¯re way too conservative.
In their political views?
Not in their political views ¡ª not like they¡¯re voting Republican ¡ª but in their social views and their willingness not to offend anybody. Kids raised on a culture of ¡°We¡¯re not going to keep score in the game because we don¡¯t want anybody to lose.¡± Or just ignoring race to a fault. You can¡¯t say ¡°the black kid over there.¡± No, it¡¯s ¡°the guy with the red shoes.¡± You can¡¯t even be offensive on your way to being inoffensive.
When did you start to notice this?
About eight years ago. Probably a couple of tours ago. It was just like, This is not as much fun as it used to be. I remember talking to George Carlin before he died and him saying the exact same thing.
"Here¡¯s the thing. When we talk about race relations in America or racial progress, it¡¯s all nonsense. There are no race relations. White people were crazy. Now they¡¯re not as crazy. To say that black people have made progress would be to say they deserve what happened to them before."Whereas Seinfeld seems to think that institutional prejudice is imaginary. He sounds more and more like this guy.
"Did you have any personal experience of anti-Semitism, in admissions or in college?From a Tablet magazine interview with Jerome Karabel, author of The Chosen: The Hidden History of Admission and Exclusion at Harvard, Yale, and Princeton.
By the time I was an undergraduate at Harvard in 1972, the Jewish issue was in the past, but I think my father did experience anti-Semitism."
A lot of white people aren't super culturally savvy. This is a joke about white people. I am white.I can't.
1. Being gayYeah I'm not sure people no longer finding an episode centering on homophobia as funny as they did in the '90s, is the giant fucking tragedy Hunter Schwarz thinks it is.
Plot: When a journalist thinks Jerry and George are in a same-sex relationship, Jerry tries to convince her they're not gay (not that there's anything wrong with that, of course).
Re-written plot: When a journalist thinks Seinfeld and George are in a same-sex relationship, Jerry just lets it slide because he doesn't know how to bring it up without making sound like there's anything wrong with it.
"Elisabeth Hasselbeck tried to compel Quinn to admit that the problem of political correctness is getting worse, but he wouldn¡¯t take the bait. ¡°Do you feel that you¡¯re being more and more restricted in your art, your profession, and what you do, and your freedom?¡±
¡°No,¡± he replied. ¡°The whole point of being a comedian is that you¡¯re not supposed to ¡ª we don¡¯t listen to the crowd. We need the crowd, but what¡¯s more insulting than someone who panders to the crowd? That¡¯s the worst thing you can be in comedy, somebody who comes out and says, ¡®Hey! I want to make everybody happy!¡¯ That¡¯s not our job. Our job is to make people unhappy.¡±
Steve Doocy continued to press the Fox News narrative of PC ascension, asking Quinn ¡°what has changed? It used to be people could take a joke, but now it¡¯s like people have no sense of humor.¡±
¡°Look,¡± Quinn said, ¡°people still have a sense of humor, but it depends on where you¡¯re coming from. You can¡¯t just [throw your hands in the air] and say, ¡®it¡¯s just jokes,¡¯ because it¡¯s not a free pass.¡±"
If you see comedy as a progressive kindergarten, or a family outing to the zoo, uh, sure. But that leveling process? It¡¯s not about healing, really. It often reflects some vicious and ugly divisions in our country that many comedians and audience members don¡¯t see as anywhere close to level¡ªor even agree among themselves, for that matter, that leveling is the needful social remedy in question. Comedy isn¡¯t supposed to be anything, except what the comedian tries to make it¡ªharmless, mean, political, dirty, dumb. You wouldn¡¯t say that music or fiction are ¡°supposed¡± to be anything; so why do we saddle all comedy with a curative democratic mission? Too often we view comedy as a craft, a service brought to us by cheerful comfort-workers, more than the work of serious artists. Thus, when they don¡¯t comfort us, we want to complain to the manager.posted by the man of twists and turns at 8:34 PM on June 13, 2015
This isn¡¯t a problem, nor is it a crisis. The redefining of ¡°funny¡± for each generation is a constant of our humor. And it¡¯s not censorship. Local vaudeville theater managers once had the authority to censor and blacklist comics at every level from the 1870s through the 1930s, on the basis of nothing more than purely whimsical local tastes. Movie studios, TV networks, magazine editors, newspaper critics (when they had weight), and even other comedians (see David Letterman versus Bill Hicks)¡ªhave all done far more to censor comedy and damage careers than anyone on Twitter or college campuses can today. Comedy has never had more venues, more outlets, more diversity than this moment, right now.posted by lodurr at 9:14 PM on June 13, 2015 [3 favorites]
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posted by palomar at 10:49 AM on June 9, 2015 [31 favorites]