God the first article is tremendous in its clear-language explanation of what the fuck is going on in the US. I am not sure I have ever read it put more accurately and succinctly. Just indictment after indictment of the absolutely fuckery at play. It perhaps doesn't go far enough to get at the money making it happen, but it's one punch after another.
posted by seanmpuckett at 1:36 PM on September 15 [54 favorites]

From the first link: " Its core supporters are low-income, poorly educated white Americans and evangelical Protestants."

This is a common misconception (for a variety of reasons that I don't want to derail things here with) that has been debunked repeatedly. The core of MAGAt support is local gentry - the lords (and to a lesser extent) ladies of the manor who rule over their own local fiefdoms and who've always bitterly resented being told that they can't, for example, enslave their workers and force them to work in inhumane conditions for a pittance. The "low-income, poorly educated" etc may be the footsoldiers of their army, and have their own variety of reasons for supporting Chump, but they have little to no bearing on the policies and practices of the MAGAt machine and are in fact ridiculed by the monsters who control those levers of power.

Otherwise, yes, a great article.
posted by Pedantzilla at 1:48 PM on September 15 [58 favorites]

I think "core supporters" is fairly accurate - it's not calling them the shapers of policy, just supporters. The shapers of policy don't get in unless the supporters vote them in. If "gentry" make up the majority of the voting public we have a different kind of problem.
posted by LionIndex at 2:13 PM on September 15 [35 favorites]

Good summary on how these were all people that the US let in to help build a plant, with visas, and how they brutalized them.

Good coverage from Jalopnik, a car site

South Korean Companies Halt Georgia Investments After ICE Raid


ICE Made South Korean Hyundai Workers Sign Voluntary Removal Papers: Report

posted by lalochezia at 2:20 PM on September 15 [10 favorites]

The geopolitical changes currently under way are not reversible.
posted by Jessica Savitch's Coke Spoon at 2:38 PM on September 15 [35 favorites]

I am sorry these folks or anyone had to go through this but glad they are loudly talking about it and that maybe some pro Trump types are feeling pain. Of course , everyone else is too.
posted by emjaybee at 2:45 PM on September 15 [11 favorites]

From Time (Sept. 11, 2025), "After High-Profile ICE Raid, Trump Reportedly Wants Korean Workers to Stay in U.S.":

The detainees were initially set to depart the U.S. on Wednesday, but Secretary of State Marco Rubio told South Korean Foreign Minister Cho Hyun during negotiations for their release that Trump wanted to ¡°encourage¡± the Koreans to remain in the country, a foreign ministry official told South Korean news agency Yonhap.

¡°That led to a halt in the departure process, in order to first hear Korea¡¯s position on whether the detained nationals, all of whom are skilled workers, want to return home or stay in the U.S. to continue working and help train American personnel,¡± the official said, adding that the detainees¡ªwho had been restrained in handcuffs and ankle chains at their arrest, according to footage released by the U.S. authorities¡ªwere ¡°extremely shocked and exhausted¡± and should return home first but could return to the U.S. at a later date. [...]

¡°Each person was allowed to choose, and the U.S. government said essentially, ¡®If you want to go, you may go; if you want to stay, you may stay,¡¯¡± South Korean President Lee Jae-myung said at a news conference in Seoul on Thursday. One South Korean detainee chose to remain in the U.S., Lee said.

From Reuters (Sept. 10, 2025), "South Korea asks US to let detained workers leave without handcuffs":

South Korea asked its ally the United States on Wednesday to allow hundreds of Korean workers to leave the country quickly and without handcuffs after they were detained in an immigration raid on a Hyundai construction site in the state of Georgia.

"Please stay so that we can continue treating you like criminals."
posted by mhum at 3:18 PM on September 15 [27 favorites]

This is local-ish to me and really reeks of a benevolent F.U. to Brian Kemp the GA (R) Gov.
posted by djseafood at 3:34 PM on September 15 [7 favorites]

If I were South Korea, I would immediately bring my people back home and put a halt to further contact, except through diplomatic channels.
posted by JustSayNoDawg at 3:40 PM on September 15 [13 favorites]

Metafilter: If I were South Korea...
posted by kaibutsu at 4:03 PM on September 15 [11 favorites]

God the first article is tremendous in its clear-language explanation of what the fuck is going on in the US.

That's because everything our journalists seem to struggle to articulate is incredibly obvious to the rest of the world.
posted by kittens for breakfast at 4:11 PM on September 15 [87 favorites]

Every time I see an update on this story I think about the many, many military bases the US has in South Korea, and how this is going to affect South Koreans' opinions about them. The US has an extremely complicated relationship with South Korea and the current US regime is recklessly making it more complicated.
posted by at by at 4:42 PM on September 15 [23 favorites]

Korean Bluesky is uniquely united on this subject. Learning all sorts of swears.
posted by funkaspuck at 4:54 PM on September 15 [14 favorites]

I can see this harming relations for more than a single generation. What an utter discrace
posted by treepour at 5:36 PM on September 15 [5 favorites]

kittens for breakfast: "God the first article is tremendous in its clear-language explanation of what the fuck is going on in the US.
That's because everything our journalists seem to struggle to articulate is incredibly obvious to the rest of the world."

I was kind of expecting some lightbulb moment after a few comments here, but the article, well-written, definitely, doesn't tell me anything I didn't already know about what's going on *waves hand in the air* over there. It's a shame more people from the US don't get to read such articles.
posted by dg at 5:45 PM on September 15 [5 favorites]

We had a vaguely similar visa issue in another country we had our factory in. We had to declare we were entering on a short term visa-waiver which does not allow you to work. The plan was to get past customs, then apply for an urgent work permit the next day which allowed you to work for up to 14 days.

I was fine since the last time I worked in the country was before I switched to my new passport so there was no immediate evidence of it. But the directors travel more often, and had to put on their best poker face when being questioned by customs.

"You are not traveling here for work?"

"I am not traveling here for work."

"But I see here on your passport that you came here for work a few months ago."

"Yes. But I am not coming here for work now."
posted by xdvesper at 6:20 PM on September 15 [3 favorites]

I¡¯m embarrassed that I hadn¡¯t even heard of this story; I think Charlie Kirk news just swallowed the entire attention of people like myself who are in a ¡°skim the headlines¡± phase of life.

What a crazy time to be an American¡­ I have no idea what we¡¯re doing, ugh.
posted by samthemander at 6:33 PM on September 15 [2 favorites]

first off, highly accurate title, it is appropriate. this is a humiliation and why.
to digress, one thing I've learned about power is that governments and individuals can hold a large portion of it but who really has a vast amount of power are those who build, to go down a rabbit hole, if this is some sort of geopolitical trick for some sort of business deal, I don't see it at least on the American scene. roughly 400 workers being detained with visas to me seems an act of political stupidity with plastic contrition. perhaps the top chaebol called their counter part in the US and asked what the hell is going on, then called the White House, or just left that to the president of thier country. perhaps this is what elicits the oh shucks we made a mistake business model of the new American economy and that's the weakness when one can't use other people's corruption against them anymore. and when you lose the power to corrupt or bribe or threaten, that's a problem in the capitalistic economic model.
I think Trump overreached in his attempt to keep various business conglomerates at Bay.
posted by clavdivs at 6:55 PM on September 15 [1 favorite]

I hadn¡¯t even heard of this story

As significant as it is [1] something like this is hugely impactful in Korea but just another Tuesday in the US. The arrest and deportment of hundreds of people legally in the US at a single event doesn't even move the needle anymore. It's why I've cancelled my plans to travel in the US. This kind of action directed at single people or small groups doesn't even get reported on anymore. I bet I hear victim blaming comments directed at vacationers who have been deported before the year is out.
posted by Mitheral at 7:32 PM on September 15 [24 favorites]

The US has an extremely complicated relationship with South Korea and the current US regime is recklessly making it more complicated.
posted by at by at 7:42 PM on September 15

It¡¯s almost as if everything this administration is doing is meant deliberately to enable China and Russia while pushing US allies away at the most critical juncture of the post-world war 2 era
posted by glaucon at 7:37 PM on September 15 [31 favorites]

Looping back ¡ª

Its core supporters are low-income, poorly educated white Americans and evangelical Protestants."

This is a common misconception[¡­] The core of MAGAt support is local gentry

Consistent: The local gentry are the big evangelical Protestants. Car dealers and repeatedly-reincorporated contractors control the megachurches afaict.
posted by clew at 8:09 PM on September 15 [13 favorites]

Man if Korea manages to break out of the grasp of the American empire, you guys better not give Trump all the credit as if it's a bad thing.
posted by jy4m at 8:35 PM on September 15 [2 favorites]

'Empire is forever until it's not'

-History.
posted by clavdivs at 9:51 PM on September 15 [13 favorites]

post-world war 2 era

pre-world war 3 era
2nd inter-war era
posted by rory at 12:22 AM on September 16 [11 favorites]

> Man if Korea manages to break out of the grasp of the American empire, you guys better not give Trump all the credit as if it's a bad thing.

South Korea and North Korea are still officially at war. There is no peace treaty, only an armistice. North Korea will continue to have the backing of China and Russia.

Like I said, South Korea's relationship with the US was already complicated.
posted by at by at 1:15 AM on September 16 [3 favorites]

Another factor is that the woman who kicked this off is proud of what she did, and would do it again. Trump can say that he wants them to stay, but there's no guarantee that it won't happen again, and a lot of reasons to believe that it would.
posted by Spike Glee at 6:52 AM on September 16 [5 favorites]

South Korea and North Korea are still officially at war. There is no peace treaty, only an armistice. North Korea will continue to have the backing of China and Russia.

Yes, but South Korea is in a completely different place today than it was in 1953. And so is China. Just like Europe is capable of defending itself and potentially interested in a peaceful relation with China, so are the Pacific Rim nations. We all just need to get used to it, and that is hard. And obviously, it is not in America's interest, but Trump and his band of fools don't understand that.

The Trump regime is creating a completely new world order, and I won't believe anyone who claims they know how it will find its balance. The only thing I'm certain of is that the US will find itself in a much worse place in a not so distant future, and it will be very, very hard to come back.
posted by mumimor at 7:13 AM on September 16 [9 favorites]

I suspect Koreans are very carefully watching the situation in Europe, where an actual incursion of around twenty armed drones into US ally Poland - possibly US chief ally in the EU - met with not one word of support from Trump, never mind actual action. I suspect China will be left standing as the one empire that actually keeps its promises, and thus a reliable negotiation partner.
posted by I claim sanctuary at 7:24 AM on September 16 [10 favorites]

¡°Each person was allowed to choose, and the U.S. government said essentially, ¡®If you want to go, you may go; if you want to stay, you may stay,¡¯¡±

Until some other ICE fascist decides they need to make up Stephen Miller's impossible quota of deportations.
posted by Gelatin at 8:16 AM on September 16

I fear the die was cast in 2014 when the United States and Great Britain failed to live up to their obligations detailed in the Budapest Memorandum.
posted by ob1quixote at 8:32 AM on September 16 [6 favorites]

> Just like Europe is capable of defending itself and potentially interested in a peaceful relation with China, so are the Pacific Rim nations.

Japan, China and South Korea have all, within the past 15 years, antagonized each other, sometimes leading to sanctions, deportations, travel bans... They (plus Russia, North Korea and Taiwan) have ongoing territorial disputes with each other. I wouldn't expect these to instigate wars, but it means the quality of relationships is very different than countries in the European cooperative spheres have.

And then there are the mechanics of cooperation. For example, Japan's constitution forbids military action outside its country. For Japan to offer assistance to South Korea if it's invaded, it will either have to amend its constitution or only provide humanitarian aid. The latter might be accepted but be of limited use, the former might not be welcome no matter how dire circumstances get in South Korea because Japan's previous occupation is still in living memory. And of course in a conflict China will not be assisting -- it's propping up North Korea.

I'm not writing this to advocate for the continuation of US military presence in South Korea (and Japan and elsewhere). It's just... complicated.
posted by at by at 8:57 AM on September 16 [4 favorites]

Spike Glee: "Another factor is that the woman who kicked this off is proud of what she did, and would do it again. Trump can say that he wants them to stay, but there's no guarantee that it won't happen again, and a lot of reasons to believe that it would."

Say hello to Tori Branum!
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 8:58 AM on September 16 [5 favorites]

pre-world war 3 era
2nd inter-war era

I prefer to think of it as L'entre deux guerres 2: Boogaloo ?lectrique
posted by the sobsister at 9:00 AM on September 16 [4 favorites]

I'm not writing this to advocate for the continuation of US military presence in South Korea (and Japan and elsewhere). It's just... complicated.

I agree, that's why I'll dare anyone to predict what is going to happen. But... England, France, Germany, Austria and Spain were each other's enemies in various constellations for at least 1000 years before May 1945. When the conditions change, politics change. When the US becomes irrelevant or worse, unpredictable, who knows how the new conditions will change alliances?

Russia and North Korea are failed states that are basically vassals to China, and they have nothing but fossile fuels (Russia) and slave labor (NK) to offer.
posted by mumimor at 9:16 AM on September 16 [2 favorites]

I suspect China will be left standing as the one empire that actually keeps its promises, and thus a reliable negotiation partner.

Problem is most of China's promises sound more like threats. This is a country that quietly redraws maps in its favor, and constantly sends fishing boats into foreign waters, and builds secret bases in South China Sea to expand its claims.

This is like negotiating with a tiger on what's for dinner.
posted by pwnguin at 9:19 AM on September 16 [6 favorites]

The USA was a major obstacle to the rest of the world meeting climate goals and if our standard of living permanently falls, it will at least reduce global carbon emissions.

I'm glad South Korea isnt allowing this to stand and is taking maximum action to punish the Trump admin economically. If everyone did this the regime would quickly collapse.
posted by subdee at 9:19 AM on September 16 [4 favorites]

The USA was a major obstacle to the rest of the world meeting climate goals and if our standard of living permanently falls, it will at least reduce global carbon emissions.

I'm glad South Korea isnt allowing this to stand and is taking maximum action to punish the Trump admin economically. If everyone did this the regime would quickly collapse.
posted by subdee at 12:19 PM on September 16

First, I don't believe S. Korea is taking economic action. They've pledged to investigate this action, and an op-ed was written in clear, cogent language that the government of South Korea should negotiate tough terms with the Trump admin instead of caving a la Japan.

Second, the US standard of living can fall way, way farther and the administration and oligarchs can grab more control by buying up assets (state and otherwise) on the cheap.

Third, I would love for there to be collective action from other nation states in a unified way. The US has far too much economic, political and military power for these countries to do that, not to mention many western nations are dealing with their own insurgent far right factions.

In short, I would love for what you wrote to be true. I doubt the possibility pretty much all the way.
posted by glaucon at 10:14 AM on September 16 [4 favorites]

Separately, is anyone aware of a collection of great reporting from outside the US about the current state of things in the US? I know I can search, I'm curious if anyone anywhere is curating pieces like this.
posted by glaucon at 10:15 AM on September 16 [1 favorite]

Metafilter: If I were South Korea...

i mean this is kinda funny given how many non-koreans in these threads like to opine so much about korea and its culture
posted by i used to be someone else at 10:20 AM on September 16 [7 favorites]

First, I don't believe S. Korea is taking economic action.
they may not need to, directly, anyway

but the chaebol are recalling their workers; a gm plant in tennessee just saw a bunch of koreans there to help fine-tune manufacturing just leave.

but also, that $350b investment thing trump keeps touting isn't set in stone yet, and the conservative cjd (chosun, joong-ang, and dong-a; hani/hankyoreh, which was linked in the op, is center-left) newspapers aren't tearing the center-left president lee a new asshole, which tells you how the ground is shifting

like seeing joongang quote a diaspora leftist in one of their articles about the raid is certainly... something.

---

as far as china goes, skorea already knows it's an... unreliable partner, given how china completely fucked over the lotte duty-free chain (lotte group) and emart (shinsegae group, spun off the samsung group) in the last decade in china to the tune of billions, the branch's bankruptcy, and exit from the market because skorea under a conservative president decided to set up a few anti-missile batteries against the north
posted by i used to be someone else at 10:30 AM on September 16 [13 favorites]

While Korean/Japanese relations have been getting a lot better lately, the positive and concerned tone in the article about Japan and it's acquiescence to Trump is an example of just how quickly Trump is turning our former allies into, at absolute best, begrudgingly leaning our direction neutrals.

And how much the drive to be shown as hateful towards anyone who isn't white and deporting as many of those people as possible has overtaken more or less every other consideration that the Trump Regime has. The top priority for Trump is maximizing how many non-white people he can deport and maximizing the number of mass arrrests and deportations he can arrange.

If it hurts an alliance? If it screws the economy? He still wants to do it. To the Trump Regime deportation is all, and he'll even sacrifice his own extortion of other nations to get a good ICE photo op.

Koreans are pissed, and rightly so. Their fellow citizens were abused, shamed, and arrested while they were in America to do something Trump wanted them to do.
posted by sotonohito at 11:52 AM on September 16 [11 favorites]

This is a common misconception...

posted by Pedantzilla

Eponysterical
posted by snofoam at 1:46 PM on September 16 [3 favorites]

see how they run, see how they hide. flagellation with a napkin mode.

"On Sunday, U.S. Deputy Secretary of State Christopher Landau expressed regret over the recent ICE raid that detained 300 South Korean workers at a Hyundai battery plant in Georgia. Landau met with Korean First Vice Foreign Minister Park Yoon-joo in Seoul and discussed a new visa category for Korean professionals, according to the South Korean Foreign Ministry. On Friday, the South Korean workers landed in Seoul to cheering crowds at the airport, a week after being chained and handcuffed by ICE. In a post on social media, President Trump wrote, ¡°I don¡¯t want to frighten off or disincentivize investment."

found a typo bit could be a real 'is is'
posted by clavdivs at 3:24 PM on September 16

pwnguin: "Problem is most of China's promises sound more like threats. This is a country that quietly redraws maps in its favor, and constantly sends fishing boats into foreign waters, and builds secret bases in South China Sea to expand its claims.
This is like negotiating with a tiger on what's for dinner."

Hmmm, that sounds a lot like another country we all know...
posted by dg at 3:28 PM on September 16 [8 favorites]

Sort of related in The Atlantic:
THE NUCLEAR CLUB MIGHT SOON DOUBLE
As American power recedes, South Korea, Japan, and a host of other countries may pursue the bomb.
Gift Link
Archive Link
I learned a lot about current feelings toward the US in Korea & Japan.
posted by ASCII Costanza head at 4:18 PM on September 16 [6 favorites]

Unless things change soon, lots of people in the US are going to learn about how other countries really feel about the US.
posted by dg at 5:13 PM on September 16 [5 favorites]

Unless things change soon

C'mon, dg

What can change soon or in 10 yrs
posted by Didymus at 6:14 PM on September 16 [1 favorite]

The only thing I'm certain of is that the US will find itself in a much worse place in a not so distant future, and it will be very, very hard to come back.
posted by mumimor

Bordering on impossible. Whatever trust and respect the USA had around the world is now ashes. At the very least it has a full generation of work to do to regain any level of it, and that work clearly ain't starting anytime soon.

It is not just due to the Trump era, the problems go back further than that, including that the USA's highly corrupting addiction to fossil fuels has been the basic reason why the world has been unable to deal promptly and adequately with critical issue of climate change.

We here in Australia understand all that well and have been actively, if quietly, pivoting away from the USA for some time ever more to the Asia-Oceania region (particularly the SE Asian part), the non-USA Anglosphere, and Europe.

A lot of that is for straight economic reasons, for many years now, and would have happened anyway. But increasingly in more recent times for political, military, and cultural reasons. We realise that the USA is not a reliable and safe ally any more, and that our interests are diverging.

So there's that.
posted by Pouteria at 8:32 PM on September 16 [13 favorites]

A lot of that is for straight economic reasons, for many years now,

i.e. Starting well before the Trump era.
posted by Pouteria at 8:38 PM on September 16 [1 favorite]

I did not have "new nuclear arms race" on my This Shitty Timeline bingo card, which was already full of shitty squares
posted by seanmpuckett at 5:10 AM on September 17 [7 favorites]

ASCII Costanza head: “THE NUCLEAR CLUB MIGHT SOON DOUBLE”

doctor_venture_sarcastic_super_great.gif
posted by ob1quixote at 10:51 AM on September 17 [1 favorite]

Yup. Any nation that has both atomic energy and a decent industrial infrastructure can be manufacturing nukes in 12 to 24 months, maybe less if they really push things.

The main difficulty wouldn't be practical, it would be political, both external and internal
posted by sotonohito at 12:14 PM on September 17 [3 favorites]

Late, but just to refresh/remind/or even update, on this point: I suspect Koreans are very carefully watching the situation in Europe, where an actual incursion of around twenty armed drones into US ally Poland - possibly US chief ally in the EU - met with not one word of support from Trump, never mind actual action

The background conditions is even more fraught but also clearcut: more than Biden era's pushed-by-circumstances-but-nevertheless-adheres-to-their-Atlantic-preference that's left the Asia-Pacific side more neglected leaving the Obama pivot mere lip service imo, now it's just a direct policy and mat¨¦riel pivot away from the Pacific: Pentagon plan prioritizes homeland over China threat - This marks a major departure from the first Trump administration, which emphasized deterring Beijing. Notable for having prominent China hawk Elbridge Colby cited for leading on this shift.

Unfortunately I don't have much to offer on the Korean side, but consider these background material.

China watchers seem to find this bit of news indicative on how China may actually act with regards to SCS sovereignty if their neighbours aren't calculated to be US allies/proxies (eg: ¡®Skull Chart¡¯ math behind Trump¡¯s climbdown on all things China ), which honestly in combination with everything, is just bad news for the Philippines who sociopolitically cannot yet come down from its decades-long political position in the way its ASEAN neighbours have managed to, never mind the actual security framework: Vietnam island building in Spratlys may soon surpass China's, report says. Basically a sort of frozen border dispute common to SEA where there's an official political position while normative reality may feel differently.

Anyway the larger US pivot away will definitely leave Taiwan in a lurch too. For personal reasons I've been very interested in the ongoing contemporary definition of Taiwanese statehood that's anchored by its indigenous polity rather than the Han Chinese majority because I think that's a potential way out but it's too far in the future (for one thing, a serious admission of this would include a renaming of the official country title, imo).

But back to Korea, the public anger isn't going to be soothed soon. In addition to this new thing, an older part of this anger has resurfaced too (last week): South Korean women file landmark lawsuit accusing US military of systematic role in sex trade - ¡®Camptown women¡¯ allege decades of abuse by American military soldiers stationed at US bases in South Korea
posted by cendawanita at 5:16 PM on September 17 [6 favorites]

This quoted article's headline and this thread's title are incorrect. S Korea hasn't been humiliated, there is no shame or dishonour for S Korea in this action by ICE. S Korea has been insulted by a nation which seems to be reverting to overt bullying and racism.

Fair minded Americans have been humiliated.

In the 60s when I was young, America was respected and envied around the world, these sentiments had subsided by the mid 70s but the USA was still thought of as an ally of the free world. Now even that is in doubt. I don't expect I shall feel respect or envy for the US again in the rest of my lifetime.
posted by epo at 4:25 AM on September 18

a) it's a korean op-ed piece, written by a korean for a korean newspaper and then translated into english, and
b) do you not think that humiliating a country by demanding it invest in your own only to detain its nationals in conditions that violate their human rights when they do invest is a kind of insult?
posted by i used to be someone else at 4:39 AM on September 18 [5 favorites]

Yes I do think it is an insult, that's why I said so.
posted by epo at 5:25 AM on September 18

This quoted article's headline and this thread's title are incorrect. S Korea hasn't been humiliated

?
posted by i used to be someone else at 8:50 AM on September 18

?
Recall the old Eleanor Roosevelt quote: "Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent."
posted by pwnguin at 9:38 AM on September 18

i mean, i just think it's interesting that it's non-koreans once again saying that a korean, writing an op-ed piece for a korean newspaper, in korean, for a korean audience, which was then translated into english, was wrong about what the whole affair means to them and what they should actually be feeling instead

i feel like i called it in this thread

i mean this is kinda funny given how many non-koreans in these threads like to opine so much about korea and its culture

posted by i used to be someone else at 9:52 AM on September 18 [8 favorites]

ah, fuck it.

i don't know why i bother to even share in these threads, you western barbarians can have at it
posted by i used to be someone else at 9:53 AM on September 18 [4 favorites]

FWIW, I took epo's comment to mean that it the United States which should feel ashamed for mistreating our South Korean friends and guests, and that the individual South Koreans did nothing shameful and South Korea as a country does not deserve to feel humiliated by this event.

Given how badly we have mistreated the South Koreans in this episode, I can see how that comment might not have been received that way. For my part, this American would like to apologize for the actions of our government.

Also, Gaza, climate change, etc. etc. etc.
posted by Reverend John at 12:01 PM on September 18 [7 favorites]

i don't know why i bother to even share in these threads, you western barbarians can have at it

whoah. Not necessary
posted by Didymus at 2:16 PM on September 20 [1 favorite]

IDK, I think we're in a moment that the part that's not necessary is invalidating how Koreans feel about the US even if from an American pov, what the US did is dishonourable and worthy of shame amongst the yankees. Feels too recentering, bringing it back to all about how bad Americans are supposed to feel, which is already a hard ask (at least this time it's not an episode directly involving the military because God forbid if people aren't appropriately sympathetic to economic circumstances that lead to colonial actions. It's just "Trump" and "ICE").

It's not the situation to tone police, imo.
posted by cendawanita at 10:09 PM on September 20 [8 favorites]

Thanks cendawanita, I wanted to bring that up but wasn't sure how to phrase it.

Pointing out that "it's only humiliating if you care about our opinion" is just a form of victim-blaming. Having images of yourself in a vulnerable or degrading position shared (widely!) is not the kind of thing most people can just shake off. (And that's setting aside the experience itself.)
posted by demi-octopus at 6:38 AM on September 21 [3 favorites]

whoah. Not necessary

what's not necessary is in virtually every single fucking thread about another country americans decide to speak over the people of that country, whether they are sourcelanders or diaspora
posted by i used to be someone else at 10:42 AM on September 21 [7 favorites]

Via Raphael Rashid:
1/ Posting on Facebook, President Lee Jae Myung said South Korea must shed the "submissive thinking" (??? ??) that it cannot defend itself without foreign troops, vowing a shift to a smaller, tech-driven "smart force" and "complete independent defence posture."

2/ Lee outlined his vision: "AI combat robots capable of autonomous detection, judgement, targeting and firing, armed autonomous drones, ultra-precision attack and defence missiles" where "50 personnel can easily handle not just 100 enemies, but thousands or tens of thousands."


More in the thread. Those security arrangements really came in quick as a consideration huh.
posted by cendawanita at 9:36 PM on September 21 [8 favorites]

Buried in this piece: South Korea¡¯s President Lee says U.S. investment demands would spark a financial crisis
Praises Trump handling of Hyundai raid

Lee, a liberal, took office in a June snap election after his conservative predecessor, Yoon Suk Yeol, was removed from office and jailed for briefly imposing martial law. Lee has sought to calm the country and its economy and said he plans to use his U.S. visit to tell the world that ¡°democratic Korea is back.¡±

(...) This month Trump¡¯s administration rocked South Korea with the arrest of more than 300 South Korean workers at a Hyundai Motor battery plant in Georgia, with federal officials accusing them of immigration violations.

Lee said South Koreans were naturally angered by the ¡°harsh¡± treatment of the workers - the Trump administration published images of them in shackles - and has warned it could make companies wary of investing in the United States.

But he said the raid would not undermine the bilateral alliance, praising Trump for offering to let the workers stay. Lee said he did not believe it was directed by Trump but was the result of overzealous law enforcement.

¡°I do not believe this was intentional, and the U.S. has apologized for this incident, and we have agreed to seek reasonable measures in this regard and we are working on them,¡± he said.

Lee¡¯s office says there is no plan for him to meet Trump in New York and that the trade talks are not on the visit¡¯s agenda.

What's the allowed level of shame here?
posted by cendawanita at 8:02 PM on September 23 [5 favorites]

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